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New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string.

 
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 10:33 pm    Post subject: New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string. Reply with quote

They're called the Short Scale Jazz series, or SSJ's for short. I'm posting them here rather than the short-scale forum since the scale length for the regular six string and 12 string is 24" 3/4 rather than 24".

They look kind of plain but I like that. Without seeing one in person, I couldn't be certain, BUT it looks like the bodies overall are a little smaller than the usual Marquee/Bison ranges which are pretty hefty guitars usually. But that could be the shorter neck throwing everything off.

Price appears to be £445 RRP for the 12 string and bass VI, and £225 for the six string, I think? Difficult to be sure because Burns are fucking dreadful at distribution so who the fuck knows.

I actually thought Burns might be done for since they hadn't done anything "new" since those limited edition Marquee-style guitars with humbuckers they did a few years ago so it's nice to see them still kicking around. genuinely interested in the 12 string since that's a gap in my collection.




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Bacchus
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baritone's the one with the jazzy trem? What's the scale length on that?

Trying to get excited for these.
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bacchus wrote:
Baritone's the one with the jazzy trem? What's the scale length on that?

Trying to get excited for these.


30 inch, proper Bass VI length. I imagine the similar setup means Bass VI strings fit it, and they're actually marketing it as a six string short scale bass too.

I wouldn't say I'm excited for them. But it's neat to actually see them making something, and doing three very different variants of the same model at once, even if that model is pretty big standard (I deliberately picked the white ones to make them look uniformly bland, the sunburst six string actually looks really nice but I thought it was funny to make them all look completely identikit).

I'd say my reaction was sort of like "oh, nice."
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benecol
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ooh, interesting. Been eyeing a Double SIx for a while now. But I'd want the old, bigboy one. As a genetic throwback, it's the immensity of Burns guitars that I like.
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

benecol wrote:
Ooh, interesting. Been eyeing a Double SIx for a while now. But I'd want the old, bigboy one. As a genetic throwback, it's the immensity of Burns guitars that I like.


Well it looks like the double six is discontinued, as is (apparently?) the Marquee. They might be intending for the SSJs to take over as the baseline models?
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:11 am    Post subject: Re: New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string. Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:



They just use standard OEM hardware instead of making specific Burns tailpieces and bridges.

Kind of reminds me of this Jansen:


Which is still better than using a strat tailpiece. A standard Les Paul bridge is playable but worse for spacing on a wider fingerboard. This is what an original looks like, except this is a 12 string:


But mainly I'm disappointed that they didn't do a Flyte or Mirage reissue. Especially a Mirage.
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:21 pm    Post subject: Re: New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string. Reply with quote

Fakir Mustache wrote:
ekwatts wrote:



They just use standard OEM hardware instead of making specific Burns tailpieces and bridges.

Kind of reminds me of this Jansen:


Which is still better than using a strat tailpiece. A standard Les Paul bridge is playable but worse for spacing on a wider fingerboard. This is what an original looks like, except this is a 12 string:


But mainly I'm disappointed that they didn't do a Flyte or Mirage reissue. Especially a Mirage.


Pretty sure the Flyte was part of their higher end range in the early 2000s, not sure about the Mirage.

Hardware is OEM where it can be, but the pickups are murkier; Burns London do have a workshop in the UK and the tri-Sonics were manufactured there, I think, at some point before they needed to churn out masses of them for the Club series, so they're now almost definitely manufactured in Korea or China (they've used both in the past), while the Strat-style fulcrum trem at least has the Burns brand stamped on the anchor point, so I don't know about them, either. It isnt actually a straight-up strat bridge copy. It operates using a fulcrum edge that sits in a grooved piece of metal screwed to the front of the guitar, held in place by the tension between the springs and the strings. The actual bridge piece itself isn't secured to the body. Look at the pictures.

Bear in mind that Burns operates two "tiers", the Custom Elite and the Club ranges. Custom Elites are "assembled and finished" in the UK using mostly parts sourced from their Korean factory (so, for example, the neck and body are CNC'ed and rough sanded over there, the parts are then shipped to London for assembly and painting) and those models tend to feature more vintage-correct hardware like the big ass tremolo with the metal plate front, and so on.

The Club series are mid to low end guitars. They used to have a core lineup of the Marquee, Bison and Double Six with other odd models like the Steer, Scorpion, etc, thrown in, made in Korea. Then they introduced a more budget range with the Cobra and Nu Sonic, Strat and Tele-a-likes that were made in China.

These particular models use the old 1960s Burns "Short Scale Jazz" model as the basis with some hardware changes (and, yes, they did used to make a "short scale six string bass", too).

The new SSJs are almost definitely Chinese made judging from the prices.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:45 pm    Post subject: Re: New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string. Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:
Pretty sure the Flyte was part of their higher end range in the early 2000s, not sure about the Mirage.

Yeah, I do remember seeing a Flyte reissue at one time.

There was also a sort of copy but with an asymmetrical body and synthetic materials called "Revolution" by Switch guitars. No relation to Burns but it did look similar.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:
Well it looks like the double six is discontinued


I figured it had been ages ago, given the state of secondhand prices.
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://reverb.com/item/12316885-2003-burns-flyte-reissue
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

benecol wrote:
ekwatts wrote:
Well it looks like the double six is discontinued


I figured it had been ages ago, given the state of secondhand prices.


The Korean Club series prices have gone a bit nutty over the last decade, though, so I don't know whether it's because the RRPs spiralled or they'd actually become harder to find. Burns took over their own distribution a while back and seemed to pretty much dry up at the exact same time.

I can't help feeling like they're struggling a little bit. Hopefully a revamped range can help them get back on their feet.
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ekwatts
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I was just having a look at the specs again...

What on earth is Lignum Rosa? They say these guitars have a "synthetic" Lignum Rosa fingerboard. Burns' specs always feel like they've been written by a child with a basic understanding of English (and actual facts since two out of three Burns guitars I've owned have differed massively from the stated specs) so I don't know what the "synthetic" bit really means, but I was searching for it on gewgle and it looks like quite a few other brands have switched to Lignum Rosa (or Lignum Vitae?) fingerboards due to import restrictions on rosewood.

Could this be the reason behind some of the discontinuations?

Yes, I know nothing about wood. But what could the synthetic bit mean?
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: New Burns guitars, including bass VI and 12 string. Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:


Fakir Mustache wrote:



cool as shiiiiiit
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:
So I was just having a look at the specs again...

What on earth is Lignum Rosa? They say these guitars have a "synthetic" Lignum Rosa fingerboard. Burns' specs always feel like they've been written by a child with a basic understanding of English (and actual facts since two out of three Burns guitars I've owned have differed massively from the stated specs) so I don't know what the "synthetic" bit really means, but I was searching for it on gewgle and it looks like quite a few other brands have switched to Lignum Rosa (or Lignum Vitae?) fingerboards due to import restrictions on rosewood.

Could this be the reason behind some of the discontinuations?

Yes, I know nothing about wood. But what could the synthetic bit mean?


Lignum is Latin for wood. Lignum rosa sounds like a sketchy way of using your existing stocks of rosewood lignum rosa by printing new labels for the boxes when you're shipping it around and selling it.

Or, is rosewood known as lignum rosa in some markets, and this is just synthetic rosewood? So plastic.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bacchus wrote:
plastic.


That's what I was wondering. That's fucking wild if that's the case but surely not?

They're probably just trying to be clever fuckers, and they've ballsed up the wording. On lots of their other descriptions they actually call their fretboards really dry which I'm pretty sure isn't meant to be the case.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ekwatts wrote:
Bacchus wrote:
plastic.


That's what I was wondering. That's fucking wild if that's the case but surely not?

They're probably just trying to be clever fuckers, and they've ballsed up the wording. On lots of their other descriptions they actually call their fretboards really dry which I'm pretty sure isn't meant to be the case.


Ha.

"We have the sharpest fret-ends in the business, and our pickups are microphonic in a way that those from other companies simply do not replicate. Our competitors just will not make an instrument like this"
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I imagine the "dry fingerboard" thing is a "wood is well cured and won't warp" boast (some guitar builders will stress the importance of dryness when buying stock of Brazilian rosewood or something as humidity can cause probs), but it's an odd flex either way and awful choice of words... can't even tell if I'm cutting them too much slack or not.
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