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A 1956 Musiclander on Ebay?
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westtexasred
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 10:32 pm    Post subject: A 1956 Musiclander on Ebay? Reply with quote

Well,this is bizarre: (Link)

"Up for auction is this 1956 Fender Prototype Swinger Arrow Musiclander in Two-Tone Sunburst Finish

All parts are dated '56.

All original with original finish.

You can see the bridge, tuners and control plate came internally from a Duo Sonic

Original 1956 Fender Stratocaster Pickup

Shows that Fender was ahead of Gibson when it came to futuristic prototypes.

Didn't see production until a decade later

Very cool piece. ALL ORIGINAL including Original Tan Fender case"

Sounds like BS(we all know the real story of the " Swinger" but still, it would answer one question I have always asked about these guitars:

"Where did the name Musiclander come from?






Moar pics

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izodiak
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a really strange guitar for my taste..

I dont remember where, but I read/saw this documentary/article about Fender and how they put these guitars ( the futuristic designs ) together using some leftovers-bad parts(cut a part off the fender usual headstock etc)..to make like 'student',cheap models.. is that true ?
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kypdurron
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this would blast everything that was ever written or known about these guitars ... which is a tough call for an ebay listing. It says everywhere that they were made in the late 60s from leftover parts.

maybe it was made (or some parts are) from an early Musicmaster or something?
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westtexasred
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

izodiak wrote:
This is a really strange guitar for my taste..

I dont remember where, but I read/saw this documentary/article about Fender and how they put these guitars ( the futuristic designs ) together using some leftovers-bad parts(cut a part off the fender usual headstock etc)..to make like 'student',cheap models.. is that true ?


Yes that is correct but that was in 1969. This guitar makes no sense as a prototype. The only thing that intrigues me is the "Musiclander" Decal. I never saw one before,have you?

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George
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Read my feedback.

EVERYBODY WHO BUYS A GUITAR FROM ME LOVES WHAT I CAN DO FOR THEM!!!
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westtexasred
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kypdurron wrote:
this would blast everything that was ever written or known about these guitars ... which is a tough call for an ebay listing. It says everywhere that they were made in the late 60s from leftover parts.

maybe it was made (or some parts are) from an early Musicmaster or something?


Could be but the 69 models were made from Bass 5 bodies. That is why they carved out the bottom.



This seller says:

"The story on this one is that it was assembled and kept on campus in Fullerton for several years from office to office internally until the sale of Fender to CBS. Was given as a gift from a former employee and has been in the same collection since the mid 60's. So it never made it to CBS Fender but obviously they eventually used the concept to try and escalate sales in the 3/4 market."

Which sounds like bullshit since the only reason to make them in 1969 was to use up the left over Bass 5 bodies and shortscale(22") necks. Still,the offical Fender name for this model is "Musiclander" not "Swinger" and this is the only one I have seen with a "Musiclander" decal on it.

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izodiak
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, about those bass bodies..thats what I read.. but I cant remember where, maybe in this Fender book I have, Ill need to check.

This guy is full of shit : D but the decal is interesting..maybe he just messed up all the years.. and his father gave him this guitar (and "told the story") while he was drunk ?
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BADmin


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would not be at all surprised by the existence of guitars with similar stories to this. it's a prototype of some kind since nothing like it has ever surfaced, but it's old enough the people involved are likely dead or not going to remember some random creation somebody had around the office.
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BADmin


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

also, nice of this guy to offer free shipping on his $16k guitar. Rolling Eyes
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Pens
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just cannot get past how he dated all of the parts to '56. Or, like WTR said, the decal. WTF?
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BADmin


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

iirc, there is a way to date at least the pickups (maybe the pots, too) by markings they place on them. i think there are even marks on pick guards, so that would just leave tuners which i would think you could tell if the screws at least had been pulled off and if the aging was wrong.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pens wrote:
I just cannot get past how he dated all of the parts to '56. Or, like WTR said, the decal. WTF?


Everyone knows if you rub a decal on your gums and they start to tingle it's pre-CBS.

edit- my bad, a quick Googling reveals that's actually a test for poisonous oysters, not Fender decals
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MatthewK
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

westtexasred wrote:
Still,the offical Fender name for this model is "Musiclander" not "Swinger" and this is the only one I have seen with a "Musiclander" decal on it.

Yeah but it's not actually a "Musiclander" decal, it's a Fender logo decal and some Letraset dry rubdown transfer lettering done by hand. The letters aren't even close to lined up, which they would be if it had been typeset for a logo decal.
My guess, the name was added manually by either the person who made it, or someone at a later date to show what it was.
There was never a Swinger decal either, the closest they got was a printed sticker next to the Fender decal.
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Phil O'Keefe
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kypdurron wrote:
this would blast everything that was ever written or known about these guitars ... which is a tough call for an ebay listing. It says everywhere that they were made in the late 60s from leftover parts.


They were - specifically, in 1969 - not in 1966, as the listing seems to suggest. While the neck dates on many Swingers (they were never officially known as a "Musiclander" or "Arrow") have '66 neck dates, that's just because Fender had a bunch of unused 22.5" necks from that year. The Swinger was an effort to get rid of the remaining unused 22.5" necks, and the leftover Bass V bodies that Fender had sitting around.

Quote:
maybe it was made (or some parts are) from an early Musicmaster or something?


That's my thought too. It's literally impossible to carve a full-sized Swinger body out of a Musicmaster body of any vintage - they're simply too small... but that doesn't look like it sticks to the original shape precisely. If it's a circa 1956 prototype, it's the first I've ever heard of it. Everything I've ever heard about the model suggests that it was developed in the late 60s to get rid of surplus parts. I would be very suspicious of the authenticity of this particular guitar.
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Phil O'Keefe
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dots wrote:
I would not be at all surprised by the existence of guitars with similar stories to this. it's a prototype of some kind since nothing like it has ever surfaced, but it's old enough the people involved are likely dead or not going to remember some random creation somebody had around the office.


You wouldn't believe some of the records that Fender still has... I can call and check if it's that big a deal or if anyone is considering buying it, but I really doubt that it's a "from the factory" prototype. It's probably a '56 Musicmaster that someone got creative with, carved up, and then refinished.
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Sven
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil O'Keefe wrote:
It's probably a '56 Musicmaster that someone got creative with, carved up, and then refinished.


Definitely. The decal is probably some type of repro. I emailed the guy to try and fill him in, but I think he's hopelessly mislead.
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Phil O'Keefe
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sven wrote:
Phil O'Keefe wrote:
It's probably a '56 Musicmaster that someone got creative with, carved up, and then refinished.


Definitely. The decal is probably some type of repro. I emailed the guy to try and fill him in, but I think he's hopelessly mislead.


That doesn't surprise me. You could have George Gruhn tell him that, and he still probably wouldn't believe it. He's probably either got too much money into a fake himself to want to believe the truth, or he's being deliberately deceptive.

Another suspect thing about that guitar - it has the post '64 pickguard shape. Fender wasn't using anything even remotely close to that shape in the 50s, nor did they use any pearloid pickguards back then either. You can explain away some things by trying to pass it off as a prototype, but if you were building a prototype, don't you think you'd generally use materials you already had on hand for things like pickup covers and pickguards? I would.

Look at the picture of the body with the pickguard off. That date area sure looks like it was taped off so it wouldn't be painted over when it was refinished. The paint color there matches what Fender used for primer back then. Also, the "swimming pool" route is also strongly suspicious. If it was a real prototype for a single pickup model, why route it differently than a stock Musicmaster? Even if you wanted to angle the bridge pickup (the original 50s era Musicmasters / Duo Sonics were routed with the bridge pickup slot parallel to the bridge), you'd normally just angle the body and route the single pickup slot, similar to how the pickup cavities on the mid-late 60s era Duo Sonic II's were done.

I'm not suggesting I know everything about every guitar prototype to come out of Fullerton, but I'd need better documentation, along with some other experts to authenticate it before throwing that kind of money down on any guitar - especially one with that many red flags.
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Sidney Vicious
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The soldering on the pots is not Fender - even a hack like I could do better - and the neck plate is screwy - the body is clean but the plate has been through war. Fraud IMHO.
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robert(original)
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the solder joints are junk on that pot. def done by a novice. the guard looks like it was cut from the danelectro factories drunk midget child. the body and neck look legit, the knobs look like radio shack specials.
the neck pup is interesting tho....
and the neck decal is very cool......
i call bullshit.
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Pens
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The angle of the pickup seems...excessively tilted to me.

I am curious as to what the serial number on the plate would come back with, though.
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