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Maple stang question

 
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 9:01 pm    Post subject: Maple stang question Reply with quote

I saw this interesting 1976 sunburst Mustang on CL.





http://dallas.craigslist.org/ndf/msg/4069729320.html

Did Maple boarded necks have skunk stripes and fake truss rod hole? Some of the pics on the internet seems to indicate yes but I have never seen one in person.

This is what the Mullet-stang might have looked like when it was stock.

It's got lots of mojo but $950 is a little steep for a 70s Mustang.
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BobArsecake
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 17, 2013 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems right to me.
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SKC Willie
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, the skunk stripe is because it's a one piece maple neck, so they have to route the back for the truss rod. And the "fake" truss rod adjustment is just from them drilling into the neck for the truss rod there.

That neck looks like it's been refinished. The 70s necks have super thick poly and even if you played A TON I have never seen an original poly neck that had that much discoloring. I guess it could be real but it looks like it's been refinished in some kind of lacquer.
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SKC Willie wrote:
Yes, the skunk stripe is because it's a one piece maple neck, so they have to route the back for the truss rod. And the "fake" truss rod adjustment is just from them drilling into the neck for the truss rod there.

That neck looks like it's been refinished. The 70s necks have super thick poly and even if you played A TON I have never seen an original poly neck that had that much discoloring. I guess it could be real but it looks like it's been refinished in some kind of lacquer.


I have a 1972 Bronco and the neck is nice thick poly as well. This neck looks more like my 1969 neck that I refinished in terms of color.

The description said if had a bad refin on the body and I assume they removed it but left the original sunburst finish. It looks just like the back side of my Mullet-stang so I don't think they took it down to bare wood and recreated the sunburst.

I agreed the neck almost looks like they might have sprayed nitro and relic'd it some. That's a awful lot of "natural" fretboard wear.
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Doug
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 10:38 pm    Post subject: Devalue Reply with quote

BobArsecake wrote:
Seems right to me.


Pretty Mustang. If it were all original, I'd agree with Bob here. Especially if that's the OHSC.

I'm not an expert, but if it's been refinished, expect a value closer to $875 with OHSC. And if anything else has been changed, tuning machines, neck refin, especially pups...looks like newer tuning machines and the dark headstock looks suspect in this photo...the value will be closer to $450, in my best judgement.

Cheers,
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Doug
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 18, 2013 10:49 pm    Post subject: Official, unofficially Reply with quote

FYI:

The mid '70s Fender Mustang

Around 1976, the black pickguard (black-white-black) replaces the white pickguard, the volume and tone knobs are changed to black ones used on the Stratocaster, and the tremolo bar tip is changed from white to black. One piece maple neck is available as an option. Along with the rest of the Fender line-up, all Mustangs had Ash body around this time frame. I've owned a 1974 and 1978 Telecaster and a 1979 Stratocaster and they all had ash bodies and weighed a ton--reason I got rid of them. Mustangs should have come from the same cut of ash as it's more expensive siblings, so there may be some real heavy Mustangs from this era.

Black-white-black plastic pickguards
Ash body
Optional one-piece Maple Neck
Headstock numbers: PAT. 2,741,146 2,960,900 3,241,418 3,143,028 3,290,980 DES. 204,098

From the "Official History", which is pretty good but technically not official.
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lots of good info. Thanks.

My Mullet-stang is a 1977 Ash body (sunburst on the back) like this one. It's got some weight to it, but it's not too heavy. Definitely heavier than my Bronco or the Comp-stang RI (basswood)I used to have.





The sunburst looks authentic so I wonder if someone did the bad refin on top of the sunburst and then they just removed it and tried to return to stock. The neck looks original but I should be cleaner. Looks like they added some distressing and finish from the body to age the neck more. The Fender logo matches late 70s Fenders. Same as my 1977 Fender Musicmaster I restored. Looks printed vs the old water decals.

The seller said the pickup were p90s? but he had the original pups. It has the Jaguar knobs instead of the Black strats as Doug mentioned. German Scaeller tuners

In summary, it appears to be a mostly original, partially or fully refinished 70s Mustang. The maple neck is a good feature, but it looks refin'd so that do kinda evens out the value.

I agreed it would be worth about 800-950 if it was original. I would consider about $500-$600 or equivalent trade.

I might contact the seller and ask for more info.
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 3:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another question about the neck.

What would normally causes all they wear on the maple fretboard between the frets? Is that just bending strings? I don't have a neck with that kinda of wear though I have seen it on Strats and Teles.

Does that wear affect the sound at all?


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robert(original)
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 6:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thats just from playing, if you look you will notice its around the string, its just from finger cheese and sweat. lacquer has many enemies and sweat is one of them.
i have a friend with an ebonized maple fretboard and its all worn to shit like an old tele.
oh, and no, it does not affect the sound at all.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

robert(original) wrote:
thats just from playing, if you look you will notice its around the string, its just from finger cheese and sweat.


+1

Nitro is sticky. Worn out '50s maple fingerboards are from residual sweat and oils being left on too long and eating the lacquer, not strings grinding away at them.
It still happens. My AV Strat (pictured below) has dirt and sweat accumulated together around the strings and frets reminiscent of the wear on true vintage versions. With time (and/or an older-school nitro) it would eat through it, at which point the lacquer would flake away during playing and look exactly like that. The back of the necks and the forearm areas on both my Strat and Les Paul are covered in gunk too... nitro can get pretty gross if you don't clean it regularly. It doesn't happen with poly (hence this neck possibly being a refin), and poly gloss necks have a less tacky/sticky feel too.
And no, it wouldn't affect the sound because strings don't rely on contact with fingerboards, just the frets.


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which one of you bastards sent me an ebay question asking if you can get teh kurdtz with that 64 mustang? Mad

robertOG wrote:
fran & paul are some of the original gangstas of the JS days when you'd have to say "phuck"
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope you've cleaned that immediately, you grubby sod. I always use Brasso on the fretboard whenever I restring, it shines up the frets and cleans all the shit away really well. Some people react really shocked but I've been doing it for ten years and learnt it from someone who's done it for forty years and is a professional without having had any damage or causing detriment to the guitar.
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

paul_ wrote:
nitro can get pretty gross if you don't clean it regularly. It doesn't happen with poly (hence this neck possibly being a refin), and poly gloss necks have a less tacky/sticky feel too.


That's exactly what I was thinking as well. I might email the seller for clarification today.

I refin'd my 1969 Mustang neck because someone had already stripped and poly cleared it and it was way too pail. So I nitro'd it to make it darker, but it had a rosewood board.
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I sent the seller a message asking about refin details and he sent me this back.

Quote:
The previous refin had stripped the original sunburst finish away and repainted it in Surf Green nitro. So I stripped the guitar, sealed it and had King Bee shoot the burst in nitro and relic it to match the patina on the neck.

The neck has not been refinished. Some of the 70's Fender necks will darken to this color and you'll even see the tan lines along the neck pocket when holding this guitar in person.


So the body is a complete refin and the neck is original finish. My 1978 Musicmaster neck was pretty dark as well but it had almost all the finish was removed.

So how does a complete body refin affect the overall value? King Bee guitars make some pretty nice guitars and it looks like the refin is pretty nice. I still think $950 is too high though.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

im almost 100 pwercent sure that the neck has been refinished. i know that my buddys 78 tele delx is noly EXCEPT the headstock is nitro since the decals were meant for a nitro finish and for some reason were compatable with poly. but on the flip side the musicmaster neck i have for robroe is a later 70's and appears that its all nitro.
can anyone verify this for me? i also want to say that there was a stupid surplus of 78 decals and they were used up until 1981 or so on certain models.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:11 pm    Post subject: Guidelines are just guides Reply with quote

taylornutt wrote:
I sent the seller a message asking about refin details and he sent me this back.

Quote:
The previous refin had stripped the original sunburst finish away and repainted it in Surf Green nitro. So I stripped the guitar, sealed it and had King Bee shoot the burst in nitro and relic it to match the patina on the neck.

The neck has not been refinished. Some of the 70's Fender necks will darken to this color and you'll even see the tan lines along the neck pocket when holding this guitar in person.


So the body is a complete refin and the neck is original finish. My 1978 Musicmaster neck was pretty dark as well but it had almost all the finish was removed.

So how does a complete body refin affect the overall value? King Bee guitars make some pretty nice guitars and it looks like the refin is pretty nice. I still think $950 is too high though.


The guideline is that a body refin takes about 40% off the vintage value. With the newer tuners, this vintage value guideline would become pretty darn firm. So if the Vintage Guitar Price Guide says it's worth $950 in excellent all-original condition, you could justify paying about $500 to $570.

But this is just a guideline...the seller and buyer are individuals and together they decide just what any one guitar's worth. Personally, I wouldn't pay over $570 for it, even with OHSC.

Hope this helps...
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taylornutt
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only way to know for sure is to handle the guitar. Nitro and poly feel completely different. I have 4 guitars with nitro necks, and 2 with poly so I know I can tell the difference. It could be a poly finish with some nitro on top. If the poly rubs off it can darken as well. I think it was at leasted relic'd a bit but it could be natural.

My Musicmaster had a 1978 neck and it was dark in places where the finish rubbed off.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Guidelines are just guides Reply with quote

Doug wrote:
taylornutt wrote:
I sent the seller a message asking about refin details and he sent me this back.

Quote:
The previous refin had stripped the original sunburst finish away and repainted it in Surf Green nitro. So I stripped the guitar, sealed it and had King Bee shoot the burst in nitro and relic it to match the patina on the neck.

The neck has not been refinished. Some of the 70's Fender necks will darken to this color and you'll even see the tan lines along the neck pocket when holding this guitar in person.


So the body is a complete refin and the neck is original finish. My 1978 Musicmaster neck was pretty dark as well but it had almost all the finish was removed.

So how does a complete body refin affect the overall value? King Bee guitars make some pretty nice guitars and it looks like the refin is pretty nice. I still think $950 is too high though.


The guideline is that a body refin takes about 40% off the vintage value. With the newer tuners, this vintage value guideline would become pretty darn firm. So if the Vintage Guitar Price Guide says it's worth $950 in excellent all-original condition, you could justify paying about $500 to $570.

But this is just a guideline...the seller and buyer are individuals and together they decide just what any one guitar's worth. Personally, I wouldn't pay over $570 for it, even with OHSC.

Hope this helps...


Very helpful. It's really close to my other Mustang, but the maple fretboard on a Mustang intrigues me. I might offer him a trade and see what happens.

I also asked him about the neck profile and the weight.
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