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Working with gear you don't like
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 2:39 pm    Post subject: Working with gear you don't like Reply with quote

So I've been playing with a few bands here. Every studio and club has the exact same gear amp wise: A roland JC120 and a Marshall jcm900 or DSL2000 with 1960A cab. I find that i realiyyy dislike the jcm900 tone. Keep in my mind my ideal amp head is a mesa boogie mark or rectifier, peavey 5150, or ENGL fireball. I'm working with these pedals now.


I love how the ac booster turns everything into instant shred, but i find it doesn't give me a big enough volume boost for solos. Also, the overall tone is pretty dark and has trouble cutting through the mix. I use the TS808 to tighten the low end but it's mainly for my rhythm tone and there's not enough gain for shreddy solos. The ns-2 is magical and my favourite pedal. Any suggestions on improving my tone?

I also find that the 1960a cab is very one directional in sound projection. I'm blasted with guitar but the drummer can't hear me. It sounds good mic'd up on a stage but in a small room i don't think it's ideal.
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George
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Joined: 03 Jul 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i would play the jazz chorus over the marshalls but i really dont like the marshall sound
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Zack
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Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

George wrote:
i would play the jazz chorus over the marshalls but i really dont like the marshall sound


Same, and while I own a jc120 I don't like how treble heavy the amp is, plus the distortion on the jc is kind of poopy. They take pedals well at least.
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Fakir Mustache
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 10:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure those amp heads you mentioned are different enough from Marshalls to matter, but if you want a different sounding cab, you could try an Orange.
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zack wrote:
George wrote:
i would play the jazz chorus over the marshalls but i really dont like the marshall sound


Same, and while I own a jc120 I don't like how treble heavy the amp is, plus the distortion on the jc is kind of poopy. They take pedals well at least.


What pedals would you recommend for a tight, djenty metal tone on the JC?
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would consider something like the line 6 m9 for an all in one effects solution but they seem to only model pedals that i hate.
Classic Distortion Angry and aggressive, Classic Distortion is inspired by* a ProCo Rat.
-ewwwwwwwwww
Heavy Distortion The industry-standard heavy metal distortion of the late '80s. Inspired by* a Boss® Metal Zone.
-aw, come on, man. Industry standard? Standard of "poo", maybe.
Sub Octave Fuzz Biting fuzz with an octave below! Excellent for bass guitar. Inspired by* the PAiA Roctave Divider
-da fuq?
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johnnyseven
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Joined: 03 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it's convenient, you could always take your own amp.

You should look on the bright side though, every studio has the same amps - so at least you have consistency. In the past we always used the same studio and you'd get different amps each week, even in the same room, one week your set up would sound ace, the next like arse. No wonder I went through loads of dirt pedals.

I think anything 'industry standard' might actually be your friend. I've found Boss pedals can handle a wide variety of amps better than anything boutique, so this may be the way to go - you may not get the best sound, but you'll get something that you can live with week on week. I would avoid anything boutique, as they can be very amp dependant and you may start a quest that will never end.
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johnnyseven
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The booster probably isn't giving a volume boost as your maxing the headroom in the amp, so it creates more distortion rather than a volume boost. You could try lowering the drive on the amp, or turning the tubescreamer off when playing a solo. Or maybe a mid boost to help you cut through.
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NickS
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Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnnyseven wrote:
If it's convenient, you could always take your own amp.
I do this (JTM 60 combo), though I should probably try to find a usable setting on the Blackstar head + Harley Benton cab at our rehearsal space.
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Josh
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Joined: 17 Nov 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JJLipton wrote:
I would consider something like the line 6 m9 for an all in one effects solution but they seem to only model pedals that i hate.
Classic Distortion Angry and aggressive, Classic Distortion is inspired by* a ProCo Rat.
-ewwwwwwwwww
Heavy Distortion The industry-standard heavy metal distortion of the late '80s. Inspired by* a Boss® Metal Zone.
-aw, come on, man. Industry standard? Standard of "poo", maybe.
Sub Octave Fuzz Biting fuzz with an octave below! Excellent for bass guitar. Inspired by* the PAiA Roctave Divider
-da fuq?

Believe it or not I have one of those me-80boss pedals which is like the lazy man who gave up on pedal collecting's pedalboard, and it seriously kicks ass. I was really surprised because I sold my me-70 a couple years back because it sounded too meh.

Figured I could trust it cause all my effects would be in one box and if an amp blows I can plug it into a pa.

Edit: oh and if they don't sound good straight up there's ways to edit each pedal on the unit. It's the most customizable box I've ever bought, it's seriously overwhelming what you can do with it. Not like those lame sounding multi effects from a few years ago, boss actually listened this time.
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

johnnyseven wrote:
The booster probably isn't giving a volume boost as your maxing the headroom in the amp, so it creates more distortion rather than a volume boost. You could try lowering the drive on the amp, or turning the tubescreamer off when playing a solo. Or maybe a mid boost to help you cut through.


You know i did have both pedals on during the solo usually... I'll try this next time!!! Thank you!
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dots
BADmin


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marshall is my first love, but I'm srsly considering dumping my jvm in favor of a Vox ac30. The studio we have been rehearsing at has a jcm900 and Vox, and I have really taken to the pedals through the latter approach. Gotta get the jvm repaired first tho.
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dots wrote:
Marshall is my first love, but I'm srsly considering dumping my jvm in favor of a Vox ac30. The studio we have been rehearsing at has a jcm900 and Vox, and I have really taken to the pedals through the latter approach. Gotta get the jvm repaired first tho.


Now don't get me wrong, the JVM is a great amp! Plenty of gain on tap, tight sound. A little noisy on the red channel but very good tone. I really don't like using pedals over the clean channel of an amp for distortion, so it's important for me that an amp has a good drive sound.

I highly recommend this amp:



Or my old love,



If you play through these you may find your dirt pedals to be obsolete!
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Believe it or not I have one of those me-80boss pedals which is like the lazy man who gave up on pedal collecting's pedalboard, and it seriously kicks ass. I was really surprised because I sold my me-70 a couple years back because it sounded too meh.

Figured I could trust it cause all my effects would be in one box and if an amp blows I can plug it into a pa.

Edit: oh and if they don't sound good straight up there's ways to edit each pedal on the unit. It's the most customizable box I've ever bought, it's seriously overwhelming what you can do with it. Not like those lame sounding multi effects from a few years ago, boss actually listened this time.[/quote]

What about the drive sounds from the pedal though? I think multi effects sound great for modulation sounds but usually lack on the drive sounds, unless going straight into the PA.
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Josh
The Curmudgeon


Joined: 17 Nov 2008
Posts: 4541
Location: George

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Drive sounds are great through all the amps I've tried it with, plus you can edit them too. Covers all the bases, I'm still trying to dial in the fuzz though. Gonna have to try editing them, I know you can do stuff to it with your computer too. Thing is 2future4me. But I actually think they finally nailed it for once, I wasn't happy with my me70, and glad I got the 80 for nostalgia.
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finboy
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Joined: 08 Feb 2008
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Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought a proco rat was THE distortion pedal for the roland jc120
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Sloan
Sexy Predator


Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Atlanta GA, USA!!!

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buy a Kemper, be fucking done.


Honestly the weakest equation in what you described is the marshall cab - I really dislike the stock g12t-75 speakers in almost every application.
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JJLipton
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Joined: 20 Apr 2006
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Location: Hamamatsu, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 11:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sloan wrote:
Buy a Kemper, be fucking done.


Honestly the weakest equation in what you described is the marshall cab - I really dislike the stock g12t-75 speakers in almost every application.


The kemper is oddly only slightly more expensive in japan. The axe fx is FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS with footswitch. Let that sink in. 5 plus 3 zeros of hard earned American greenbacks.

I saw a band last night that used an orange rocker verb and jcm800. They sound was sooooooo much better.
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dots
BADmin


Joined: 17 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JJLipton wrote:
dots wrote:
Marshall is my first love, but I'm srsly considering dumping my jvm in favor of a Vox ac30. The studio we have been rehearsing at has a jcm900 and Vox, and I have really taken to the pedals through the latter approach. Gotta get the jvm repaired first tho.


Now don't get me wrong, the JVM is a great amp! Plenty of gain on tap, tight sound. A little noisy on the red channel but very good tone. I really don't like using pedals over the clean channel of an amp for distortion, so it's important for me that an amp has a good drive sound.

I highly recommend this amp:

Hidden: 


Or my old love,



If you play through these you may find your dirt pedals to be obsolete!


those (and sloan's suggestion) look/seem pretty rad, but i'm going combo and under $1000 for this purchase. it's gotta be tube powered with minimum one 12" speaker and have at least 30w since i already have a 15w combo. a separate drive channel would be great to have, but it isn't a requirement.

i walked over to guitar center yesterday to try out what they had in stock. the twin reverb was, of course, the best overall tone with those incredible low frequencies and glass-shattering highs. it's way overkill, though, even if i can pick one up used for $500 - $700. i wasn't impressed with any other fender -- not the blues, not the deluxe, not the hot rod. anytime you engaged the overdrive on those, it lost all bass and sounded squashed to shit.

i tried a couple marshall combos and was very disappointed. the clean tone is honest and true, but wtf is up with the new DSL overdrive? it sounds plastic and lifeless. i had to double-check that it wasn't a solidstate version. especially considering what they get for those amps, i couldn't believe my ears.

i didn't try any of the orange amps as they were all heads or solidstate. i do notice there's a dude in LA with a th30 combo for $700 on craigslist, so that is on my maybe pile.

the vox ac 30 sounded lovely and was the only thing i plugged into that rivaled the fender twin for tone and power. they're both heavy as fuck, though, so casters would be in my future since i have such a long walk to my car from the apartment. the ac 15 lacked the punch, and the night train was just not my style. someone's got an ac 30 for $800 on craigslist, and he's way more local. i might offer him $700 and see what happens.
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robroe wrote:
I'm fuckin old dudes

jcyphe wrote:
But the people need that wiggle stick.
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singlepup
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^ I was just going to say that the AC 30 is a heavy amp! I checked out an AC 15 recently and was stunned by its weight too. My Deluxe Reverb is so light in comparison.

However, you're right about smaller Fenders and low end. I think you're really barking up the right tree with the AC 30, though the Twin would work perfectly too.

Craigslist it all the way. I got my Deluxe for $700 on CL.
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