20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

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Rhysyrhys
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20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

I played through a buddies Fender Twin the other day after only playing through my Line6 and Headrush FRFR for about 18 months or more and I forgot how nice tube amps are and how "real" and "chewy" they sound with that glorious breakup and all the other good shit that we all jerk off to in private and on internet forums for time immemorial. Tubes r teh greetest.

I'm now on the GAS train for a small-ish tube combo/lunchbox head n' cab that I can put in the boot of a Subie Crosstrek and will sound good in a bedroom or small gig. In both head and combo variety!

What are y'all playing through/lookin' at!? So far my shortlist of stuff to go and play down at the GC is:

Marshall SV20H 5/20w, I used to have a 50w master vol mk2 and I can imagine this to be that but smol
PRS HDRX 20 No switchable wattage, but reviews incredibly well. Apparently at JTM-45 inna 20w lunchbox, might be too loud at 20w for home but price is right
Mesa Badlander Always wanted a smol Mesa because I like the idea of having a hotrodded fender clean, then switchy bois for my distortion channel, not sure if they are a pain to maintain tho
Friedman JJ Jr Alice in fucking Chains dog, AIFC. "I!" duggaduggaduggadadug "I!" duggaduggaduggadadug! I FEEL SO ALONE GUNNING UP A BIG OLD PILE OF THEM BONES. Probably don't actually want this amp but y'know, duggadugga!!!!@11111!
Orange TH-30 Reasonably priced Orange. Can't remember if I like Orange now, I remember they are loud I think I always hated their crunch channels...
Fender Supersonic 22 Supersonics have always been good IIRC, had one about a decade in a combo with a Jensen speaker. Remember Alf? He's back! In pog form!
Egnater tweaker Always piqued my interests, never touched one or know anyone who has?
Victory amps, The Duchess and others Not wattage switchable, these fuckers are in every YouTube video in the background but I don't know anyone who owns or GAS's for one... are they good???


Now you may say, Rhys, all these amps achieve different stuff what are you _really_ looking for? I say to you: something that takes pedals good, and in lieu of that something that has enough clean but an absolutely godly break up and 2 channels so I can take an overdrive pedal off my board.

Tell me folks what'll it be for you in the sub 50watt category? Combo or head!
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Rhysyrhys
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

Also honourable mention for Milkman Sound If I ever win the lottery/become a millionaire somehow I will be buying one of these with the floral tolex, but for now I will be stopping by the showroom/factory in SF whence I next return to play a few. Apparently the build quality and tone are staggering, I was listening to Josh Smith play through one a few weeks ago and, my word, it does sound like a glorious vintage Fender with a 6V6s in. 3000 bucks tho :O
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by NickD »

The PRS and a Weber attenuator. 50w is too big for most gigs, 20w is fine to gig with if you don’t play super clean, but way way too loud for home use unless you have a big detached house.

I’ve run my 18 watt 2x10 Marshall unattenuated a couple of times at home and it gets to 108/110db. Even a 5w amp is over 100db.

Milkman amps sound great, but there are some other really good options if you are looking for a hand wired, non master volume, just turn it up kind of amp at a little less than Milkman prices.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

NickD wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 7:37 pm if you are looking for a hand wired, non master volume, just turn it up kind of amp at a little less than Milkman prices.
All ears mate.
NickD wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 7:37 pm The PRS and a Weber attenuator. 50w is too big for most gigs, 20w is fine to gig with if you don’t play super clean, but way way too loud for home use unless you have a big detached house.
Yeah I remember owning a 50w Marshall master vol and not even getting past 1 on the MV dial in the house and barely above 4 even in big gigs, I've played through the Orange Terrors and they are loud as fuck as well at 15w. I think for that reason I would like switchable wattage, but as you also say, 5watts will do a fantastic job keeping the neighbours in check even still.

That PRS gets absolutely amazing reviews from everyone, I had no idea that they even made good amps. I knew they made amps and were somewhat related to Paul Rivera somehow but I thought he was full time on the Rivera brand shit... it's an interesting beast for sure.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

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I think what's really getting me going is the "Internal Jumper" shit they talk about where the whole amp is defacto jumper'd so you have a treb vol and bass vol which is channel 1 and 2 respectively for a JTM-45 without having to jumper it.

EDIT: also holy cannoli the 50 watt version is 2099, which I guess it's 2.5x the wattage so 2.5x the price??? Noting that its not 5881s, its ECC803s in the 50w incantation but I feel it's quite rare to see that difference in price? Maybe I'm out of touch.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Thom »

Seeing how this started with you playing your mate’s Twin you should probably consider a couple more Fender amps too. ‘65 Deluxe Reverb or ‘68 Pro Reverb.
The Marshall SV20 is super loud, you won’t get any breakup without an attenuator, though the same can be said for most valve amps without preamp gain control. Also worth having a look at the Marshall Origin 20. Combo or head. Takes pedals really well, I really like it. We clubbed together and bought my Dad the combo for his 70th last year and I’ve had my eye on a head ever since. Can’t beat it for the price.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by NickD »

Marshalls are batshit expensive in the states, nowhere near the value we get here.

Rhys, Thom’s Fender recommendations are sound, especially if you use pedals.

I’ve got a Morgan PR5 which is super loud for the size, so the slightly higher wattage PR12 would be a good shout, especially if you like the kind of sounds Josh Smith is getting. I use mine with an attenuator, even at 5 watts it’s louder than you’d want at home. Their AC20 is a great sounding amp too, and has power scaling built in.

They are little pricey new over here, but OK used and I’d expect much easier to find in the US.

I believe Friedman are similar price wise to Marshall in the states, and are better built - they do a few 20w options.

On the cheaper end a Pro Jr is a great amp and brilliant value, and an AC15 sounds great too.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by plopswagon »

No love for Blackstar?
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ekwatts wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 12:53 pm The word "moisty" has made me irrationally angry.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by NickD »

I had an HT5 for a few months and it was OK. But in that kind of price range I’d go for the Fender or Vox unless the two channels and tons of gain were a necessity. I find the fewer controls the better in general, otherwise I spend too much time twiddling.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by plopswagon »

I’ve never had one but I tried them. That’s what I love about my Pro Jr. 2 knobs.
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ekwatts wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 12:53 pm The word "moisty" has made me irrationally angry.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Pens »

I've been shopping around for something Twin-like but not earbusting as well. The Supersonic was one route, but I was also considering a Champ.

I am probably going to test out pulling two power tubes and one speaker from my Twin to see how that goes. Supposedly drops the wattage to like 30-ish. Might be okay for recording.

I bought on Black Friday sale a Bugera PS-1 attenuator, and initially I loved the thing. I could use my Twin but at home volumes. However, after using it for a few weeks, there was a point where the volume suddenly dropped out, and the thing was HOT, so I immediately shut my amp off and unplugged everything. The Twin is fine, but now every time I use the PS-1, the sound is very heavily distorted. I think something partially burnt out on the attenuator. I'm leery of them at this point.

Basic point, since you're in the States, look at local shops for a Champ, or the SuperSonic. If it's all about the Twin, those will probably put you in the right ballpark.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by NickD »

A 100 watt attenuator can’t really take a 100 watt amp down to home volumes, they are meant to cut some of the volume, not all of it. I use a 50 watt one on an 18 watt and a 5 watt amp, the 18 watt is still pretty loud if you want it to still sound good, but the 5 watt keeps its tone at home volumes.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Freddy V-C »

NickD wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 7:37 pm 50w is too big for most gigs.
You take that back.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by dots »

if you can find one at a price point you like, the fender prosonic has 30w, 50w, and 60w modes (classes A, AB, and AB SS respectively).
the TL;DR version is the amp is (over)designed to be a versatile, rugged workhorse since you can blow your tubes and still run it solid state -- might be spendy, though.

full version is the 10" celestions can get crystal clear with headroom for days and then break up naturally if dialed in that way. it takes pedals masterfully like fenders tend to do (there's a non-switchable fx loop, i just plug straight like the troglodyte i am), but it also has a way over-engineered drive channel (foot switchable) with two adjustable knobs for pre and post gain.

ok, there is some debate out there whether this is a "true channel switching amp" or if it just has switchable gain modes. it doesn't help that fender labeled the footswitch "CHA", but gear nerds gonna gear nerd. :roll: look, it's got a footswitch that controls turning on gain in the amp, so think of it however you like. even though i tend to shorthand it to "channel", i do understand if you mod the amp, that mod applies to both the normal and high gain modes.

back to the tone, the drive section is incredibly sensitive and allows you to sculpt anything from jazzy breakup (with a little help from the 3way EQ) to full on death metal with both gain stages dimed. bruce zinky apparently designed the platform to compete with mesas and marshalls in the late 90s while still being able to get along with your stomp boxes. it works as designed and quite well i think.

reverb is also foot switchable. beyond that, there aren't a whole lot of options here if you're only counting the one knob that dials in the amount of reverb you want. it is that classic, fender-sound, spring 'verb we all recognize which works in a lot of applications (especially live). just don't go expecting to get plate or hall response.

the downsides include they haven't been made for 20 years, so you're at the mercy of 2022 gear prices (i see them on reverb for between $900 - 2k). the footswitch also tends to pop when changing modes if it hasn't been modified. the 30w mode also may not be considered "bedroom volume" (though i have played mine at low levels without complains from the neighbors in the townhome).

so yeah, not a small amp, though not a monster either. it is tube-a-riffic for sure!
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Bacchus »

I'd get a THD Flexi 50
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by taylornutt »

Thom wrote: Sat Dec 24, 2022 5:01 am Seeing how this started with you playing your mate’s Twin you should probably consider a couple more Fender amps too. ‘65 Deluxe Reverb or ‘68 Pro Reverb.
The Marshall SV20 is super loud, you won’t get any breakup without an attenuator, though the same can be said for most valve amps without preamp gain control. Also worth having a look at the Marshall Origin 20. Combo or head. Takes pedals really well, I really like it. We clubbed together and bought my Dad the combo for his 70th last year and I’ve had my eye on a head ever since. Can’t beat it for the price.
68 Custom Vibrolux Reverb and Pro Reverbs are fantastic. Supersonic 22 would also be nice if you like switchable channels and higher gain.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

So interesting development, I found one of these local to me:

PRS Sonzera 20w which seems to review well also, hoping I get a job next week because if I do I will go check it out. Good pedal amp, 20w 6V6 and two channels for 500 bucks.

http://offerup.com/item/detail/500663d ... ?q=sonzera
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Pens »

NickD wrote: Wed Dec 28, 2022 5:11 pm A 100 watt attenuator can’t really take a 100 watt amp down to home volumes, they are meant to cut some of the volume, not all of it. I use a 50 watt one on an 18 watt and a 5 watt amp, the 18 watt is still pretty loud if you want it to still sound good, but the 5 watt keeps its tone at home volumes.
Yeah, I guess I just overestimated it's abilities. It's 100w rated, and the Twin is like 60w, so I figured it would handle it. By default it cuts to 50%, so I turned the amp to 6 as that's my personal favorite spot, and then had the attenuator at like 3. It was fine for a while, but it scared the hell out of me when the volume dropped a lot.
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

Put an offer on that PRS Sonzera thats near me. $420, cos its a funny number. Lets see how it pans out...
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Re: 20-40w tube amps - what do we like SS?

Post by Rhysyrhys »

He wouldn't accept 420 boooo, but did accept 435 which, ok whatever have ur 15 dollars, bub.

Finally, 14 years after creating my Shortscale.org/forum account I will finally be able to get the sondzzz(era)

I'm winging my way to Chinatown 10am tomorrow, gonna bring it home slap it down and try to demo it, though I have no microphone...
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