Annie Clark of St Vincent designs her own sig guitar

[NickS]

Equilateral curved triangular knobs, that's a bit different.

[Corsair]

Corsair,

I would have never guessed from that post you were trying to link her sexuality to the aesthetic of the guitar design. The two thoughts were sentences apart and seemed unrelated. That said, I don't see it but lets look at what some experts have to say:

You said: "So her signature guitar is shaped like a boxxy girl dress, complementing their boobs and bottoms and it feels more comfortable for women to play. "

Ernie Ball said: " .. the unique electric guitar was crafted to perfectly fit her form, playing technique and personal style."

Annie Clark herself said: "I was always finding when I was playing onstage and wearing various stage outfits the guitar would cut across one of the best features of the female body, which is your waist. I carry my guitar pretty high so I had to make all of these costumes based on the fact that you wouldn’t be able to see if I had a waist or not. I wanted to make something that looked good and not just on a woman, but any person."

So there it is. One of the above statements is patronizing and sexist. By the way it isn't that you even said the guitar looked good on her (or "compliments her boobs and bottom" if you want to put it that way), it was that you assumed it was why the artist herself designed it.

You don't need to keep digging the thread back up to explain or defend your post. I get that you weren't trying to be sexist. It was casual sexism; the condescending/stereotyping/mansplaining sort which tends to slip out accidentally if your social circle is also made up of people who say things like this. I don't think you hate women or are that ignorant. Just try to learn from the experience and move on.

All good points. Yeah, you're right it's probably a slip of the tongue stemmed from my social circle, which in comparison to me, I can assure you, is way worse when it comes down to everything mentioned in this whole thread. Not to put me on a high horse or anything.
I'm all for women's rights, all I really want in the world is peace and equality.
I'm sure there are sexist subconscious undertones in my mind, gathered from my experiences while growing up as well as what was taught to me and through Americas media/commercializing turning women into objects.
I've only become aware of it as I've gotten older and I've still got ways to go.

Also, I agree with George. It's much better to have a civil discussion without the need to bring in ferocity, insulting or being condescending towards people. Unless you're dealing with an asshole or troll, you may as well ignore them. This is one of the reasons there is such a big divide politically in our country right now. Because each side is attacking the other instead of having any intellectual discussion in a manner to understand either side.

Maybe one half could dial down the accusations and the other take a pause to reflect on what a few of us have said and try to take it on board?

I think it's the ferocity of the challenge, not the challenge itself (which was warranted).

[Corsair]

I think this is the first and only place where I've been called sexist. And have people break down nearly everything I said and give their interpretation of how it is sexist. Which, I don't mind having a civil discussion about but if someone comes at me with any sort of hate, anger or condescending tone. Well I'm either going to ignore or fuel the fire. But if you confront me in a non confrontational manner, I'll be more than happy to hear what you have to say.

But now I feel like I gotta walk on eggshells on a guitar forum incase I trigger someone, while not intentionally trying too trigger someone and offrail a subject into the realms of what is sexist or any other taboo subject that's against the "collectivism" of the forum.

Also, "Mansplaining", can someone tell me how that isn't sexist and hypocritical?

[Nick]

Aw c'mon dude, your last post was way more chill.

Nobody was calling you sexist. Even when Speedfish said I did, (along with making rude condescending PERSONAL assumptions about me), I did not. I said the comments made were an example of sexism. There is an obvious difference between accusing someone of being a sexist and accusing someone of saying something sexist (something we've all probably done at one time or another).

Also "mansplaining" isn't sexist and hypocritical because I haven't seen women explain things to or on behalf of men in a condescending and patronizing manner often enough for society to have coined a new term for the reverse of it. In the same way that "white privilege" isn't racist.

[George]

When someone goes on about "triggering" or puts other bait out like you're doing, it's a good litmus test (for me) to know when they're just memeing or trolling, so let's see some of that good faith modelled from now on *thumbs up*

This edged (pun intended) into a Pub thread pages ago, in my opinion, and mansplaining is a whole other discussion unto itself.

Saying it's sexist against men because it only goes one way is a bit ironic because of its sexist connotations to begin with, so it's kind of like saying it's reverse-sexist against men or something (I don't know the semantics on that). In other scenarios I guess it's just condescension.

It's largely about how women feel undermined and silenced, particularly if interrupted by men in certain situation. I believe it's gotten better in recent decades, and the term is thrown about a bit too carelessly, with media/social media tending to only show silly examples/accusations of it, but I don't seehow anyone can really deny the history of women being in a forced secondary position of authority or knowledge, and being talked down to as the inferior sex, that "men know best", effectively being infantilised. This power dynamic is less palpable now, but still exists. It's not a defined thing really either; like, you're not going to go to prison or be fined for mansplaining, it's just an annoying thing some women have to deal with from time to time.

So I don't think it's sexist against men at all as a phenomenon, but calling men out unwarrantedly is, if it's purely because a man is explaining something to a woman, and then it backfires and becomes blown out of proportion, particularly as most men don't seem to realise it. But it's a messy topic and all over the place, like most of this social justice stuff.

[Nick]

It's sexist against men to call a man out for doing something that's sexist against women?

Give it a rest George.

[George]

Reductive as fuck.

[benecol]

Nobody was calling you sexist.

I was. Showed my working and everything.

[BoringPostcards]

So yea that guitar is pretty sweet huh?
For fuck's sake by'z let's get back to the godforsaken EBMM already!

[theshadowofseattle]

I don't like it.

[Nick]

I still want to play one but haven't found one locally to try. The local GC got that ugly Petrucci one in instead because ALBANY

[Corsair]

Aw c'mon dude, your last post was way more chill.

Nobody was calling you sexist. Even when Speedfish said I did, (along with making rude condescending PERSONAL assumptions about me), I did not. I said the comments made were an example of sexism. There is an obvious difference between accusing someone of being a sexist and accusing someone of saying something sexist (something we've all probably done at one time or another).

Also "mansplaining" isn't sexist and hypocritical because I haven't seen women explain things to or on behalf of men in a condescending and patronizing manner often enough for society to have coined a new term for the reverse of it. In the same way that "white privilege" isn't racist.

Sorry, that was a bit of a rant. I was at the gym pumping iron. Seriously though I was lol. When you get that testosterone pumping, it can affect your mood dramatically, especially depending one what type of weight lifting you're doing (big muscle areas like legs spike your test levels through the roof) more than you even realize sometimes. Lucky, it only lasts for me while I'm at the gym and a bit afterward. Every guy knows what I mean to an extent. I've been weightlifting for over 4 years now. I do it as a hobby and for a mood lift since I do have Dysthymia/Persistent Depressive Disorder. Not crippling depression, just a constant low mood with low motivation. Been on all sorts of meds, some kinda help but only usually in one area and not the other.
Also tried self-medicating with other drugs years ago. But that's a story for another day. I'll just say, I was going all out full TEH KURTZ when I was young and took it to the next level in my early twenties after a two-year relationship with my high school crush ended after she finally broke up with me for good. Said she felt trapped and that I was just a convenience. And I went into the darkest depression I have ever known. And I wanted to numb everything, along came prescription opiates then found a cheaper KURTZ method.
A bit random I guess, but i'm giving you some of my background history.




Like I think I said before, there are subconscious levels of sexism that I probably have. I won't deny that and I think a majority of men do. Same goes for stereotyping and racism to some extent for some people.

[gusman2x]

Dude, that might have been the smartest response to the whole thread de-rail. Or the dumbest. Not sure, but I thought it was cool....lol

[George]

One of us.

[speedfish]

When someone goes on about "triggering" or puts other bait out like you're doing, it's a good litmus test (for me) to know when they're just memeing or trolling, so let's see some of that good faith modelled from now on *thumbs up*

This edged (pun intended) into a Pub thread pages ago, in my opinion, and mansplaining is a whole other discussion unto itself.

Saying it's sexist against men because it only goes one way is a bit ironic because of its sexist connotations to begin with, so it's kind of like saying it's reverse-sexist against men or something (I don't know the semantics on that). In other scenarios I guess it's just condescension.

It's largely about how women feel undermined and silenced, particularly if interrupted by men in certain situation. I believe it's gotten better in recent decades, and the term is thrown about a bit too carelessly, with media/social media tending to only show silly examples/accusations of it, but I don't seehow anyone can really deny the history of women being in a forced secondary position of authority or knowledge, and being talked down to as the inferior sex, that "men know best", effectively being infantilised. This power dynamic is less palpable now, but still exists. It's not a defined thing really either; like, you're not going to go to prison or be fined for mansplaining, it's just an annoying thing some women have to deal with from time to time.

So I don't think it's sexist against men at all as a phenomenon, but calling men out unwarrantedly is, if it's purely because a man is explaining something to a woman, and then it backfires and becomes blown out of proportion, particularly as most men don't seem to realise it. But it's a messy topic and all over the place, like most of this social justice stuff.

George,

Nick brought The Pub to All Other Guitars when he posted ("Double standards and that."Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:03 am) which is a reference from my posting in The Pubs U.S. Presidential Election 2016 post.
http://www.shortscale.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=63362 in which I complained about there being a double standard between the U.S. and countries affected by the travel ban.

That let me out of my cage.

I'm sorry if I've made your position as the moderator more difficult or uncomfortable.

Thanks, for your patience.

[speedfish]

I think this is the first and only place where I've been called sexist. And have people break down nearly everything I said and give their interpretation of how it is sexist. Which, I don't mind having a civil discussion about but if someone comes at me with any sort of hate, anger or condescending tone. Well I'm either going to ignore or fuel the fire. But if you confront me in a non confrontational manner, I'll be more than happy to hear what you have to say.

But now I feel like I gotta walk on eggshells on a guitar forum incase I trigger someone, while not intentionally trying too trigger someone and offrail a subject into the realms of what is sexist or any other taboo subject that's against the "collectivism" of the forum.

Also, "Mansplaining", can someone tell me how that isn't sexist and hypocritical?

Sorry for the shitty welcome to Shortscale. Your comments don't meet the current definition of sexist and they aren't anymore sexist than an advertisement for a padded push-up bra in a woman's or teenage girls magazine. That said your reading comprehension could certainly use some work! LOL




http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dict ... ish/sexism

sexism
noun [ U ] US ​ /ˈsekˌsɪz·əm/
​
actions based on a belief that particular jobs and activities are suitable only for women and others are suitable only for men:
Sexism continues to keep girls out of plumbing, electrical, and construction trades.


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sexism


sexismplay
noun sex·ism \ˈsek-ˌsi-zəm\
Popularity: Top 1% of lookups
Examples: sexism in a sentence





Definition of sexism
1
: prejudice or discrimination based on sex; especially : discrimination against women
2
: behavior, conditions, or attitudes that foster stereotypes of social roles based on sex
sexistplay \ˈsek-sist\ adjective or noun



http://www.dictionary.com/browse/sexism?s=t



sexism
[sek-siz-uh m]
Spell Syllables
Examples Word Origin
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
noun
1.
attitudes or behavior based on traditional stereotypes of gender roles.
2.
discrimination or devaluation based on a person's sex or gender, as in restricted job opportunities, especially such discrimination directed against women.
3.
ingrained and institutionalized prejudice against or hatred of women; misogyny.


British Dictionary definitions for sexism Expand
sexism
/ˈsɛksɪzəm/
noun
1.
discrimination on the basis of sex, esp the oppression of women by men

[speedfish]

I don't see your point at all. I can tell you're trying to make one. Are you calling Annie Clark a sexist for patronizing a strip club?

No, just the opposite. My point is that she is a liberated woman defying social stereo types and exploring her sexuality just as a man might. She is partnered with one of the most beautiful women in the world, just like the stereotypical male rock star, male athlete or actor. She is living the rock-n-roll life style "drugs, sex, and rock-n-roll!" and I think it's fantastic!

[dezb1]

.

Why do you need to use your coat hooks as a carrier bag dispenser how many poly bags does one man need?

[Nick]

When someone goes on about "triggering" or puts other bait out like you're doing, it's a good litmus test (for me) to know when they're just memeing or trolling, so let's see some of that good faith modelled from now on *thumbs up*

This edged (pun intended) into a Pub thread pages ago, in my opinion, and mansplaining is a whole other discussion unto itself.

Saying it's sexist against men because it only goes one way is a bit ironic because of its sexist connotations to begin with, so it's kind of like saying it's reverse-sexist against men or something (I don't know the semantics on that). In other scenarios I guess it's just condescension.

It's largely about how women feel undermined and silenced, particularly if interrupted by men in certain situation. I believe it's gotten better in recent decades, and the term is thrown about a bit too carelessly, with media/social media tending to only show silly examples/accusations of it, but I don't seehow anyone can really deny the history of women being in a forced secondary position of authority or knowledge, and being talked down to as the inferior sex, that "men know best", effectively being infantilised. This power dynamic is less palpable now, but still exists. It's not a defined thing really either; like, you're not going to go to prison or be fined for mansplaining, it's just an annoying thing some women have to deal with from time to time.

So I don't think it's sexist against men at all as a phenomenon, but calling men out unwarrantedly is, if it's purely because a man is explaining something to a woman, and then it backfires and becomes blown out of proportion, particularly as most men don't seem to realise it. But it's a messy topic and all over the place, like most of this social justice stuff.

George,

Nick brought The Pub to All Other Guitars when he posted ("Double standards and that."Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:03 am) which is a reference from my posting in The Pubs U.S. Presidential Election 2016 post.
http://www.shortscale.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=63362 in which I complained about there being a double standard between the U.S. and countries affected by the travel ban.

That let me out of my cage.

I'm sorry if I've made your position as the moderator more difficult or uncomfortable.

Thanks, for your patience.

WAIT

HOLD ON

WHAT

THE

ACTUAL

FUCK?


I brought what to the other guitars section?

You think I was referencing your post in another thread?

Seriously?

Get your head out of your own ass. You're not that important. I didn't even see your comment in that other thread, and if I reacted to it months ago or something I don't even remember. I said the comment was was a double standard because it fucking was. You went and made this personal with me over that crazy connection you made?

[Nick]

I don't see your point at all. I can tell you're trying to make one. Are you calling Annie Clark a sexist for patronizing a strip club?

No, just the opposite. My point is that she is a liberated woman defying social stereo types and exploring her sexuality just as a man might. She is partnered with one of the most beautiful women in the world, just like the stereotypical male rock star, male athlete or actor. She is living the rock-n-roll life style "drugs, sex, and rock-n-roll!" and I think it's fantastic!

Oooooh so the woman rock star can defy social stereotypes and behave just like a male rock star would? Um, men and women alike quite often go to strip clubs for fun if that's what they like to do. There's nothing wrong with it, and if you think there's some sort of social barrier that's being broken here that's just your narrow worldview.